Hillywood and Goodbye Dinner

Went to see Eric's office named "Hillywood".


He showed me his current office (above)





and his new office and the movie theatre [first in Kigali] he is building in an up and coming Kigali neighborhood. Many new apartment houses with great views. I don't think there are bad views in Kigali or Rwanda anywhere.

In the afternoon met up with Benoit who wanted me to meet with the architect of the building at Nyanza-Kicukiro to let him know the kind of ideas I have been discussing with Benoit and Freddy. I shared our vision of using the building at Nyanza-Kicukiro as an interview center for Kigali and surrounding area. We would conduct the interviews here, maybe establish up to 4 rooms in which two interviews a day could be taken. The Center over time would be phased into a destination for research and education. It would house the testimonies, possibly other relevant research materials and the relevant technology [most likely in an annex to be build for such purpose] necessary to provide digital access to thousands of videotaped testimonies. It would also function as HQ for the project GTR IBUKA. Freddy and I have been discussing that there should be four or five interview centers - one in the North, South [possible at the Murambi school], East [Kibuye?] and West in addition to the one at Nyanza-Kicukiro, where most of the interviews would be conducted. The meeting went well and it turns out the architect had studied at the Technical University of my hometown in Darmstadt, Germany. Small world indeed.

After the meeting, spent a moment in Kigali's only mall, then back to hotel to pack and get ready for the goodbye dinner at the Gorilla hotel.


The dinner included the German ambassador and folks from the German Development Service (DED) - I got to speak German while in Kigali, not something I expected.

The IBUKA team is about to embark on a 10 day trip to Germany to tour the country - mainly Berlin and area around - to get an idea of how Germany is remembering its past - Fascism and the Holocaust and what happened in East Germany. Wish could follow them around when I am in Germany next week. It would be so interesting on so many levels. Though we only overlap for one day in Berlin - Friday, May 23rd - I will hopefully have a chance to meet up and welcome them there. It is just not long enough to reciprocate the kind of hospitality I was privileged to experience in Rwanda.

Minister of Sports and Culture, and Interview #3

Another full day beginning with a meeting with the Minister of Sports and Culture, Joseph Habineza, at his office in the soccer stadium. We spoke about the USC Shoah Foundation Institute and the interview project and the collaboration with IBUKA. He gave his support [and that of the government] and offered to be of help when possible. All and in all a great meeting in a great office. Loved the art work on the wall.


After the meeting, on the way to the Kigali Memorial Centre at Gisozi we stopped at the Novotel in the government area to meet up with Benoit. Got to see a little of a different neighborhood. The US Embassy is easily recognizable - it is big and surrounded by intense security.



Another view from Freddy's office terrace at the Kigali Memorial Centre. Freddy and I discussed some budget items and interview process. We will have to devise a plan where interviews will be conducted at interview locations set up for that purpose. It will be too difficult to conduct most interviews in people's homes. In most homes, it is almost impossible to shut out the noise from the outside and availability of electricity is not common, so far. While we were working on Freddy's terrace which is right over the main entrance, a large group of Rwandans came in to visit the Memorial Centre. They all wore purple scarfs around [sign of mourning] and when the group started to come out of the exhibit, a woman from the group began to scream/cry/whale for over 15 min. w/o stopping. It was the most painful sounding screaming cry I have ever heard in my life. This was another reality check moment - and it was hard to talk about the process and budget while listening to her anguish.

I was told that during the last annual mourning ceremony, they had about 150 people scream like her. They said it is hard to know what to do with so many at the same time. Let alone with just one person in such dire straits - they help by holding their hands, letting them sob and/or try other ways of consoling.

Afternoon, we went back to Yves house to conduct a third interview. Conducted outside again - in the backyard.


The survivor's interview included a story about how he lost his son. Venuste K. was also a survivor of the massacre at Nyanza-Kicukiro like Emmanuel G. from the first interview. During the massacre, Venuste had held his 2 yrs. old in his arms when he got shot, killing his son and damaging his arm which he ultimately lost. We had a late start already and the light was going - at the end, we used a flash light to light Venuste. After the interview, he wanted to think about signing the release which included allowing access on the internet - the survivor's only concern was that he does not want his testimony to be used in the Arusha trials. Another side note, Venuste was among the six survivors that Pres. Clinton got to meet in 1998 when he visited Kigali.

Dinner at Gabo's house - which was much fun. Sitting outside on the terrace with a great view again, thunderstorms all around on the horizon, incredible lightening. Unfortunately did not bring the camera, so no photo from here.

Tomorrow no gorilla trekking as previously planned - the visit is scheduled for Thursday morning leaving the hotel at 4 am to make sure I will be back in time to catch my plane to Brussels in the evening.